In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Colleen Breems discuss:
- Letting a niche form over time
- Earning trust through depth and preparation
- Using competence as the foundation of marketing
- Positioning intentionally with the right relationships
Key Takeaways:
- Niching down is a gradual process shaped by consistency, passion, and earned trust. Being focused does not require rejecting all other work, only clarifying what you are known for. A clear niche strengthens credibility and often opens doors to adjacent opportunities.
- Strong niches are built by mastering statutes, procedures, and expectations within a specific role. Every case should be treated as reputation-defining, regardless of size or visibility. Reliability, preparedness, and professionalism compound into long-term trust.
- Visibility is effective only when it reflects genuine skill and consistent performance. Writing, speaking, and sharing expertise help decision makers remember you for a specific strength. Marketing should amplify substance, not replace it.
- Focused networking outperforms broad, unfocused relationship building. Clear positioning makes it easier for others to understand, remember, and refer to you. Niching is strongest when aligned with real demand and access to decision makers.
“Don’t wait until you’re ready… Letting fear or doubt stop you from going after a niche is really the biggest roadblock.” — Colleen Breems
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About Colleen Breems: Colleen M. Breems is a partner practicing exclusively in matrimonial and family law. She represents clients in divorce, parentage, post-decree matters, prenuptial and postnuptial agreements, and related family law issues, with a focus on practical, client-centered solutions.
In addition to representing adults, Colleen is frequently appointed by Cook County judges to serve as a Child’s Representative or Guardian ad Litem, advocating for the best interests of children in family law cases. She is also a trained mediator and parent coordinator.
Colleen is deeply committed to public service, dedicating significant time to pro bono work through Chicago Volunteer Legal Services and serving as Co-Vice President of the Advocacy Council for the Junior League of Chicago.
Connect with Colleen Breems:
Website: https://beermannlaw.com/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/colleen-breems-a8a4631b/
Connect with Steve Fretzin:
LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin
Twitter: @stevefretzin
Instagram: @fretzinsteve
Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.
Website: Fretzin.com
Email: [email protected]
Book: Legal Business Development Isn’t Rocket Science and more!
YouTube: Steve Fretzin
Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Steve Fretzin [00:00]
Hey everybody. Steve Fretzin here, and I just want to share really quickly, before we get to the show, that I’m hosting a live webinar that will help you create the law practice of the your dreams, not just the one you have without selling or pitching. It’s called sales, free selling. How to Make It Rain without selling. And if you want more growth that feels natural and sustainable, I’d love to have you there. Just go to fretzin.com/events, and please join us for this career shifting hour. It’s on February 19, and I hope to see you there to be that lawyer. But for now, enjoy the show.
Narrator [00:36]
You’re listening to be that lawyer. Life changing strategies and resources for growing a successful law practice. Each episode, your host, author and lawyer coach, Steve Fretzin, will take a deeper dive, helping you grow your law practice in less time with greater results. Now here’s your host, Steve Fretzin, hey everybody.
Steve Fretzin [00:58]
Steve Fretzin, here and welcome to the be that lawyer podcast. So happy that you’re joining us. This show is really for you. It’s helping you be that lawyer, confident, organized and a skilled Rainmaker. Colleen, here’s something interesting. I googled incognito business development, legal, business development podcast. Now nobody else in the world would ever search for that. I don’t think, but I did, and this show came up first. So I think for legal business development, this is the podcast, if you go to Marketing, maybe not, but legal business development, so that’s so good to see you.
Colleen Breems [01:31]
You too, Steve, and congratulations. That’s a big deal. Yeah, I go to legal business development podcast.
Steve Fretzin [01:38]
I think it says something about, you know, just being consistent and beating that drum for a period of time. But regardless, if somebody types that in on Google, hopefully they like the show and they get hooked on it and can enjoy it the way that. And I listen to it, I enjoy, I don’t like necessarily like hearing myself, but I enjoy hearing my guests talk and sharing their wisdom, and we’re gonna have some fun with that today. That’s the plan, right? I agree. It’s almost like you developed your niche. It’s almost like I did. We may have been, you know what? We might come back to that. Let’s we’ll think about that and come back to it. And Colleen, I just also want to share like, there’s a lot of people in this world, and there’s a lot of lawyers I’ve worked with and have friendships with, and and you’re just one of the most wonderful people. And I couldn’t imagine a more delightful person to work with and have as a client and a friend and so to get you back on the show, my heart was swelling with joy, so I’m putting, just putting that out there a little we have a little bit of a love fest over the next 30 minutes. You know, that’s why?
Colleen Breems [02:31]
Well, the feeling’s very mutual. Steve, I’m so grateful to have had the opportunity to work with you and get to know you and then to be here to catch up with you on your podcast. I’m honored. Thank you for the invitation.
Steve Fretzin [02:40]
Yeah, and talk some shop too, maybe, right? I love it, all right. Well, let’s dive in. All right. So this show has a very popular opening in the quote of the show. So Abraham Lincoln, good guy. Wish we had him back today. His quote is, whatever you are, be a good one. I don’t know if I feel that way about some people, depending on what they are, but we won’t get into that. But tell me why you like that quote. And again, welcome back to the show.
Colleen Breems [03:06]
Thank you so much, Steve, so I love Abraham Lincoln. He’s obviously one of the greatest lawyers that we know about. And I think that the quote really speaks to what I’d like to talk about today, which is whatever it is you set out to do whatever your calling is, whatever your dreams are for your career, put your all into it, do your best to be the best. There’s really no point in developing the career of your lifetime and just being mediocre at it. You want to be good. And not only do you want to be good at what you do, but you want to be a good person while you do it. So good in every sense of the word. That’s why I just love that quote.
Steve Fretzin [03:43]
Yeah. And if you’re whatever you are, if you’re not that person, if you’re a bad person or negative person, then don’t be a good one. Be a bad go away. We don’t want to talk to also, there’s that. Colleen Breems is a divorce attorney partner at Biermann LLP in Chicago, very large boutique Family Law Office, and give everybody a little bit of your background how you came to be. Yeah.
Colleen Breems [04:08]
So thanks, Steve. I’m a divorce and family law partner at a law firm called Biermann. We are one of the largest family law firms in the nation right now. We’re based in Chicago as well as in the North Shore, and we do all family law, so every manner of family law you could think of, from litigation to mediation to Collaborative Law to guardian ad litem child representative work. So it lets us wear a lot of different hats to uniquely help whichever clients or family comes to our door. I love getting to do what I do. From the time I was 11 when I took my first job, I’ve always been working with families and always been working with children, so I just kept that going into my adult professional career. I love getting to work with individuals. I’m nurturing, I’m empathetic. I have a strong sense of right. And wrong. I love to argue. So coming to law, you would think would have been a natural progression, but really, I went to my undergrad at University of Illinois, at Urbana Champaign, planning on being a pediatrician, and instead I failed into being a family law lawyer. We call it failing forward. Failing forward Exactly, and that’s really because my favorite cousin, who also was at University of Illinois for law school when I was there for undergrad, kind of showed me how cool and fun law could be, and ended up being my pre law advisor. And I still talk to him about practicing. He’s a judge now, and, you know, I got really lucky and kind of stumbling into the career that ended up being the exact right fit for me. I can’t imagine doing anything else. And I mean that truly,
Steve Fretzin [05:49]
yeah, and it’s interesting you, you sort of changed the whole perception of what I thought about divorce lawyers. Because my father, the great, late, great Larry, the lawyer, everybody he divorce is the only area of law that he didn’t that he got out of. He was like, that’s, that’s like, too cruel, even for me. And he was a shark, you know, he’s a shark in the night in the best, nicest way. But like, you didn’t want to go up against him, because he was so smart and good. But then I had this perception that, you know, you got to be sort of a badass attorney, and you got to be kind of nasty to be in family, and then I meet you, and I’m like, wait a second, this is, like, the nicest person I’ve ever met in my life, and she’s doing family. And I’m like, Okay, so maybe, you know, maybe, you know, kill people with love versus, you know, with, you know, aggressiveness and, you know, Shark like tendencies, so, and we met it when you were at a different firm, was that, and I’m going, I’m just going to put a number and say, like, eight years ago, or something like, gosh, I think you’re right. Yeah, okay, all right, I’m just throwing that’s just pure out of my brain that I came up with that number and at the time, had you, and I don’t remember, had you really thought much and done much around business development, or was it really, and you could tell I, you know, don’t, you know, I’m just, I’m just wondering if that’s when you really kind of got into business development, and that’s when, or were you doing it before?
Colleen Breems [07:05]
Yeah, so you were definitely my first and only business development coach, and up until then, when I met you, I was networking. I was a young associate, and I knew the importance of networking, and I knew the importance of building those relationships and bringing in that book of business, but I didn’t have much of a strategy about it. So I found that I felt like I was spinning my wheels a lot of the time without really allowing any predictability into how I networked and how I brought in my business, and really was not focusing my efforts in the most streamlined way. So that’s where we started working together, and it’s been so great. It’s been so helpful. I call upon the skills that you shared with me still today, and I’m so grateful to you for sharing them with me.
Steve Fretzin [07:50]
Well, you were, you know, when I work with I always say this, and I stopped working with law firms at the beginning of the pandemic. And you know, your group is no different. There’s 10 people, and two are going to be amazing, and eight are going to just say, you know, got something out of it, but didn’t do much with it. And you were one of the two that, really, I felt, stepped up and actually executed and did the things that we were talking about. And that led you to your current firm, and it led you to not only becoming, you know, a much stronger business developer, but then you took another kind of turn in niching your family practice, into something where, you know, there’s not, you know, it’s like they talk about, like, blue ocean, you know, there’s bloody red with the competition. And you, I think, found a place where maybe there’s competition, but certainly not like, straight up divorce,
Colleen Breems [08:36]
yeah, yeah, you’re right about that. And it was just really a matter of following my passion and paying attention to what I really loved about family law. And if you were to ask me why I got into family law, it’s really to work with children and to help children. So with that, as soon as I possibly could in my practice, I did what I could to get on the guardian ad litem and child representative list in Cook County, which is a specific list that you can be added to after sitting for a 12 panel interview and completing training in which you are on a you’re in a smaller group of family law attorneys. I mean family law attorneys in Cook County is a big pool, and you make it smaller by being one that’s on the guardian ad litem child representative list in Cook County, and it really turned out to be what I love to do. Being on that list means that judges in Cook County were not already representing adults in a family law case appoint me to that case to advocate and represent the best intrusive children in those cases. And I love what I do, I really went into it just because I truly wanted to work with children. And, you know, came in really, really hungry and excited and really thrilled at the opportunity to get to help children like this. And now it’s really become the majority of my practice, and I’m really grateful for that. And it really just came from. Wanting to do it, being excited for it, and, you know, hopefully doing what judges expect me to do, and doing it at a good level.
Steve Fretzin [10:08]
And I think Pete, there’s a misnomer about niching down, which is that you find what you love, you find the people you want to work with, and that there’s money there, okay, there’s an opportunity there, and you just flip a switch and all of a sudden you’re, you know, in that niche. I don’t think that’s really how it worked for you. I don’t think that’s how it worked for me. I think there’s a transition period. Can you talk about that a little bit? Yeah.
Colleen Breems [10:31]
So what I would say is, you know, niching is definitely not overnight. And also, I think it comes with your passion. It’s not something that you could just wake up one day and say, This is my niche. I think when you’re following a niche, you’re following something that you’re really passionate for, that you’re really on fire for, and you’re putting in the boring work where you’re just being reliable, you’re being predictable. You’re working the long hours to do the great report that will help the judge make good decisions for family. You’re doing everything you can to take the temperature down on high conflict cases and basically be the most helpful you possibly can for the judge who appointed you. And that’s a lot of work, but when it’s something that you want to do and it’s something that you’re doing, well, people take notice, and with that, you’re not announcing your niche. You’re not announcing this is what I do now. I don’t do any other family law cases. I just do this. But when you do this work, and you do it consistently well, and it shows and how you comport yourself in a full courtroom, judges notice, attorneys notice, and they remember you. They remember you as someone who’s a problem solver and someone who wants to do this. And I did find that niching your practice isn’t it’s not saying no to other opportunities. Instead, it’s becoming sharper, and it’s using leverage with your passion as your guide. Were there other
Steve Fretzin [11:53]
things that you did when you sort of made that decision to over time? You know, niche down and, you know, start either writing more or speaking more like, you know, more social media like things that would that would make it clear to people that this is your space.
Colleen Breems [12:09]
Yeah, I would say the first thing I did was make sure I had exposure. And that looked like saying yes early. I was saying yes to those appointments, to those difficult cases, to the longer hours and to the learning curves, and I treated every case I was appointed on as if the entire courtroom was watching, because often they were. And then the next phase was, you know, going from competency to consistency. I made sure I knew my statutes cold. I learned my local practice even colder, and I became reliable. I wanted to be someone that judges knew I would meet deadlines, write that thoughtful reports, and handle high conflict parents calmly, and then from there, I looked for visibility without self promotion. I didn’t market myself directly to judges. Eventually, they would come to see me as someone who does this work and does it well, and I let my words speak through the hard work I did, through the written reports, through the courtroom demeanor, and through the professional reputation I have with the attorneys on my case. So to me, it really seems like the combination of mastery and consistency was better than any marketing gimmick. Yeah.
Steve Fretzin [13:15]
So you know, the competency and the relationships, I think, is where a lot of of niching down can happen, because you’re becoming known and respected in a particular area. The piece that I would add to that, and it sounds like you did some of this, but it’s not about like, Hey, look at me everybody. I’m so great, you know, on social media, but maybe it’s, you know, sharing, you know, examples of cases or situations that people are in and, you know, commenting on them and giving some commentary, or, I don’t know, like there’s ways of putting it out there and educating people, not selling yourself. Were you involved in some of that? Or was it more relational, relationship
Colleen Breems [13:54]
based, you know, so much of it was relationship based. But I did write articles about the work that I was doing, you know, kind of educating the general family law community about the differences between, say, a guardian ad litem role as opposed to a child rep role as opposed to an attorney for a child role, because those are three distinct roles. And kind of talking about how that works, and you know which type of appointment might be a good fit for your case. Also, I’ve always been open to doing, like speaking engagements on the topic, getting on the phone with a colleague who might have some questions because they’re working with a guardian ad litem, and really doing my best to be an, you know, in assets, a tool that people can call upon to help. But in terms of, like, outward promotional marketing, it was much more just letting my work and my reputation speak for itself.
Steve Fretzin [14:44]
Yeah, I think for you that that’s going to take care of it. I think for for some of the folks listening that need to have a deeper, you know, kind of grab of of the niche, I think, you know, the relationships and the competency is going to play a part of it. Again, I’m. Need to also depend on the niche that you choose, and some of it’s going to have to involve more marketing, right? So how are you becoming known in Milwaukee, Wisconsin for personal injury, right? I mean, you can build relationships around that, but you may also need to get a billboard and tell everybody about it. So I think we have to consider, for the folks listening that it’s niching down is a big decision, but I would say, do it, you know, over time, right? And I would say also, then combine the relationships in the marketing, if you can, together over that time, and so then you’ll get the kind of the best punch.
Colleen Breems [15:35]
I agree and I think when you are considering niching down, whatever that niche is, then, you know, I agree with you. How you approach it is different for every niche. But, you know, don’t keep your achievements to yourself. If you’ve got a certification or you just gotta added the list to be a guardian ad litem or child rep, talk about it. Tell other people, make sure it’s something that people remember later on, because when they need you, they’re going to remember it, and also pick a niche that puts you near decision makers. So I think when you’re looking at the niche that you’re selecting, look at who the decision makers are for that, you know, for me as a guardian ad litem or a child rep, those are the judges. So I wanted to, you know, make sure I was doing good work for whoever decides whether I get hired again, and that’s judges. But if you’re if you’re picking a different niche, where you need to be working more with banks, for example, make sure you’re networking with those banks. Make sure you’re going to events with them. Make sure you’re putting yourself out there so they know about what sets you apart and what you’re really excited about doing. So that way you’re not just another face in the room, but instead, there’s something special and specific about you. And again, in doing that, you’re not narrowing your opportunities. Instead, you’re really broadening your horizons, because you’re going to be the go to person for this specific thing, as opposed to someone who is just a family law lawyer. And people may not even know what that means.
Steve Fretzin [17:01]
Yeah, an additional angle to this is, there’s the niche of what practice area you’re in, or what subcategory of practice you’re in. Another area of niche and that people don’t always think about is industries, right? So, you know, I’m going from working in 50 industries as a business development coach to one industry, right? So not only am I niche in that, I could be, you know, I’m marketing, business development, leadership, opera like there’s all these recruiting, these skills and talents and things that I have developed over years. I picked one business development, it’s my favorite. It’s the one I’m most passionate about. And then on top of that, I doubled down and only working with attorneys. So somebody that’s in personal injury may want to just focus on, you know, motorcycle accidents, and market and promote and talk about that. And someone in family. There’s a guy in Chicago that did this years ago, this Jeffrey leving, or whatever, I don’t know, not going to speak to his reputation. But you know, father’s rights, right? So he figured, not only niche and divorce, but let’s just focus on on the father’s rights. I think he did pretty well with that.
Colleen Breems [18:02]
Oh, yeah. I mean, I think he is who people think of when they think of father’s rights. He’s synonymous with father’s rights because of all of the marketing he did.
Steve Fretzin [18:11]
Did, but he didn’t. Is he even doing it anymore? I don’t yet ever see him anymore. Yeah, that’s back like in the 9080s, or 90s. Yeah.
Colleen Breems [18:19]
I think it’s very important to know your market, know who you are marketing, to know who your decision makers are, and play to that. But you cannot confuse branding with substance. If you’re going to be marketing, you have to be good at what you’re doing and show that you’re, you know, consistently reliable at doing good work there,
Steve Fretzin [18:38]
yeah, especially if you’re if you’re promoting your own business, I think the one example of when people don’t necessarily do that is NPI, when you know they market themselves as the best lawyers going to get you the most money. They farm out all the work. Granted, they have to farm it out to lawyers that they know are going to do the job. But I think they’re, they’re not the ones actually that are going to do it. But I think in many, in most instances, the lawyer that’s niching down is the one doing it, or that’s going to manage it, manage that account. And yes, to your point, you got to be the best. You can’t settle, you know, for not knowing your stuff. That’s exactly right. Hey everybody. Steve Fretzin Here [email protected] They don’t just market law firms. They help them grow from connecting millions of consumers to trusted lawyers, to smarter intake and industry leading events. They’re building stronger connections across legal visibility, intake events, growth. That’s lawyer.com Check them out today, with proven SEO and digital marketing strategies that drive actual clients to your firm. Rankings.io. Prides itself on proof, not promises. Mentality. The best firms hire rankings.io when they want rankings, traffic and cases, other law firm marketing agencies can’t deliver, get more rankings, get cases and schedule a free [email protected] today. Hey everybody. It’s Steve Fretzin as the. You know, I’m the host of the be that lawyer podcast, and if you’re serious about growing your law practice, let’s talk. I’ve coached hundreds of attorneys to build bigger books of business without selling, chasing or wasting time. This isn’t a sales pitch, it’s a real 30 minute strategy session to explore what’s possible for you in your practice. Just head over to fretzen.com and grab a time that works for you. And let’s make this your breakout year, Colleen, there are a number of lawyers listening who thought about this lots and lots of times, and they haven’t pulled the trigger. And I think one of the main reasons is it’s that FOMO, that fear of missing out, right? And if I give up, you know something, let’s say you end up, over time, going all in, but you’re now giving up. You know, let’s say you went all in, you’re not doing any more diverse work. I mean, then what? How do you circle that square? Yeah.
Colleen Breems [20:48]
So I don’t think that niching limits your opportunities. It does just the opposite. Once people trust you in one role, they’re going to trust you in others. When you’re the go to for this specific niche, they will see you as competent and someone who could handle other areas. And it’s important to know that niching down doesn’t mean that you’re saying no to other opportunities, like I’m still a family law lawyer. I get hired to mediate and I get hired to litigate on behalf of adults. I get hired to do collaborative law. I get hired to wear all of those hats that I worked hard to educate myself to wear but guardian ad litem child rep stuff is really just kind of like the special part of my practice, where not everyone does it, and it’s something I do, and I hope that I do it well, but it doesn’t mean that niching down means that you’re completely exclusive and you don’t do anything else unless you make that decision, and when you do make that decision, you’re going to know the time’s right for you. You’re going to know that your niche is so self sustaining that you can do that. Yeah, any any
Steve Fretzin [21:51]
warnings that you would give to lawyers about niching down things that maybe you learned as you were doing it that they should watch out for?
Colleen Breems [21:59]
Yeah, I would say, first, don’t wait until you’re ready. I mean, you’re never going to feel like you’re the absolute master at this. And now it’s time to announce it and become the niche. Instead, it’s to follow that passion. Don’t ignore what really lights you on fire about doing your work. Pay attention to it. Be mindful of it, and follow it, learn as much as you possibly can about it. If you see people who are in that niche and you’re excited about that, take them out to lunch, buy them a coffee, learn from people who are doing it already, and then see if there’s a way to make it your own. But I think that letting fear or doubt stop you from going after a niche is really the biggest roadblock?
Steve Fretzin [22:43]
Yeah, and I would just, I’m just going to put in my my two cents here. On top of it is that it’s easier to make a decision to niche down when you have a lot of business coming in. I mean, if you’re dry and you’re just waiting for the phone to ring and nothing’s happening and you’re not billing hours and things are looking tough, you could think about niching, but I think it’s when you have a full pipeline, when you’ve been out there hustling and when things are coming in, and you’ve got some buffer to then maybe direct your effort and direct your marketing, your time, energy, money, whatever, in developing out the niche. But I think you know business that you know this is the business development show, right? We’re obviously on Google, as we mentioned, so whatever, anyway. But I think that it goes back to, you know, maybe the basics of, you know, you got to be out there and doing and bringing in the business and having a full pipeline.
Colleen Breems [23:28]
Yeah, I agree. And that really comes with marketing and business development. I think that every attorney could benefit from networking and keeping up with that network. And that’s where that becomes extremely important.
Steve Fretzin [23:41]
Well, it’s also where people learn about you, and not that you do everything. Like, you know, if you’re in litigation and you’re just saying, you know, anybody has a problem on the guy or on the gal or whatever, like, that’s not going to help anybody really refer you. So I think there’s niching down, but there’s also just being very clear about the audience that you serve and how you’re going to be remembered. And we do a lot of in the class that I teach now on Tuesday mornings, we spend a lot of time on infomercials. And it’s not just so that people are prepared to talk intelligently at networking events or at the you know, when there’s a group of people, I think it also helps them start to recognize their niche, or recognize their why or what makes them unique in the space all which are really important, you know, elements and how you’re being remembered?
Colleen Breems [24:27]
Yeah, I completely agree. I think that it’s one thing to walk into a room and say, I’m a family law lawyer. Anyone going through a family transition give me a call that’s not memorable. People aren’t going to call upon that as easily as they would when you walk in and say, I’m a family law attorney in Chicago, and I love representing children as a guardian ad litem or child rep, and then they’ll ask, Oh my gosh, what’s that? And then you have a dialog. Then it’s much more memorable, and you’re talking about a really narrow, specific type of case that when it comes across their desk, they’re not going to think of anyone. Will spite you, because it’s so unique.
Steve Fretzin [25:02]
Yeah, there was a gentleman from your firm when I went to my first networking event 20 Hold on. I’m not gonna say who it is, but I thought it was so it’s so unique that he said this, and it was shocking and jarring to me, and also funny, because he did in front of 100 people. So we’re going back 22 years, the Northbrook chamber. He stood up, and he said his name, and he says, We will divorce you. And it was this thing, and it was in the face, it was, but I’ll tell you what
Colleen Breems [25:29]
memorable No, 15 years later, obviously, was the perfect hook.
Steve Fretzin [25:35]
Oh yeah, oh yeah, you don’t forget something like that. And I think at the time, I was just like, you know, I newlywed, right? I was just blessed that I wasn’t even, I was still in the literal honeymoon phase. But I just, you know, I think, you know, something that we didn’t talk about as much about niching down, is how memorable it can be that when you’re when you’re known for everything, you’re really known for nothing, right?
Colleen Breems [25:57]
Yeah, I agree. I think that you don’t want to be, you know, a master of everything. You don’t want to say, I do every type of legal practice that there is.
Steve Fretzin [26:06]
We do this, we do this, we do this. And just like, here’s a laundry list everybody of everything I do, none of it that you’re going to remember, right?
Colleen Breems [26:13]
And I mean, that works for some people, but I think it’s much more effective to pick the thing that you’re passionate about and become as good at it as you possibly can. And I think that that’s going to speak volumes to other people, all
Steve Fretzin [26:26]
right, everybody just, just to recap real quick before we get to Colleen’s big mistake, I think it’s love what you do. I think you’re identifying that there’s a market that you could, you know, go into, that’s less competitive, right, or that you can compete at a high level. And I think if it’s something where you see that there’s, you know, it’s recession proof, or you can make a real living doing it, that’s kind of like the three way winner, from my standpoint. So fantastic. All right, here we go. It’s showtime. What’s Colleen’s Big mistake?
Colleen Breems [26:54]
Yeah, you know. So that’s a great question, and I had to think about it a little bit. And I think for me, it was really how I was operating before I met you, Steve. So I guess this is the perfect commercial for working with Steve Fretzin. But as a new attorney, I knew that networking was really important, and so with that, that meant to me meeting absolutely everyone I could in Chicago and having coffee with everyone. And while that was great, and I met a lot of amazing people, it wasn’t the best use of my time, because I wasn’t being strategic about who I was meeting with and the why I was meeting with them, and then taking the time to build and form those relationships. Instead, I was getting coffee with what seemed like every single financial advisor, and then I couldn’t possibly build a relationship with every single one of them. So working with you really helped me to pare that down, be much more intentional, and it’s been so much better ever since. So my big mistake, I think, is being a little too excited to network and going in without a plan.
Steve Fretzin [27:58]
And you know what? It took me working with a coach too, because I had the same thing that Northbrook chamber that were where I just explained that infomercial That was funny. You know, I was meeting with our the Amway salesman, the Avon lady, the you name and financial in northwestern insurance. Yeah, I’ll give you 12 names of all my family members to call and, you know, get business from. Holy crap. Did that come back to me, haunt me. Don’t do that, by the way. FYI, yeah. Just such, such great I appreciate that. And again, it’s, you know, a player and a coach, and I find myself only as good as the players that play. So I appreciate you so much for that. Let’s take a moment. Thank our wonderful sponsors. Of course, rankings, io, crushing it. If you are looking to make a spend on your marketing. That’s the way to go. Rankings. Io, for that law her podcast with Sonia. You know, all ships rise when it comes to women. And you know, it’s interesting, Colleen, when I worked with you, and just generally, you know, there weren’t many women that I was working with. I mean, I’m just going to put it out there is maybe 10% good year. 20% now it’s about 60% so it’s really been women are really coming on. And I want to thank Sonia for being such a great advocate for the women out there with her beautiful podcast. And of course, lawyer.com if you want to get found, get on lawyer.com Colleen, people want to get in touch with you. They want to refer you. They loved everything you said. How do they find you?
Colleen Breems [29:17]
Yeah, well, I would love to connect. Thank you so much. My website can be found at www Beerman law.com Bierman has 2e and two n’s. My phone number is 312621, 9700, and my email address is my first initial, C, followed by my last name, breams, B, as in, boy, R, E, E, M, as in Mary s at Bierman law.com Yeah.
Steve Fretzin [29:45]
And we’ll put all that in the show notes as well. And I just want to tell you how blessed I am, and I feel that we’re friends and that I have you in my life, and I apologize that we haven’t connected in a while, but I’m I’m just so over the top happy that we did today.
Colleen Breems [29:58]
Well, likewise, Steve be. You so much for your time here. It was so fun to catch up with you, and thank you for having me on.
Steve Fretzin [30:04]
Well, listen, you’re the You’re the star of the show. You shared your wisdom and really helped everybody sort of get an idea of what it really means to niche down and and how that can benefit your life and your the people you work with and the space you’re in. I want to thank you everybody for hanging out with Colleen and I for the last 30 hopefully helpful helping you make some tough decisions about how you’re going to spend 2026 to be that lawyer, confident, organized and a skilled Rainmaker, take care. Everybody. Be safe, be well, and we will talk again very soon.
Narrator [30:35]
Thanks for listening to be that loyal, life changing strategies and resources for growing a successful law practice. Visit Steve’s website, fredson.com for additional information and to stay up to date on the latest legal business development and marketing trends for more information and important links about today’s episode. Check out today’s show notes.